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DEATH PENALTY, CON'T. Thomas Perillo Jr. TOMDGIMP tomdgimp@excite.com On 7/10/2001 07:55:00 AM, FawCawnahs wrote:
>Barbarism is killing people
>you don't HAVE to kill.

****No HAS to be killed. We can just slap them on their wrists and tell them that they were bad little boys and girls, and that they have to stay in their rooms for a couple of years, right?
People like Ted Bundy, and Charles Manson SHOULD be allowed to live on and become cult heroes to other a$$holes out there, right? Wanna buy a Charles Manson T-shirt?
Hell, we shouldn't have killed McVeigh, we could have given him life with counseling, until some bleeding heart said he was cured, and he was mentally unstable when he blew up the building, so he could be released to do it again.
What the hell, there's too many people in this Country anyway.

>You don't HAVE to kill
>everybody who deserves it,
>like people who cut you off on
>the freeway. We don't kill
>most people who kill other
>people criminally in this
>country.

****If you think someone that cuts you off deserves to be killed, maybe I'm not such a barbarian, huh?
I'll say it again (and again), if you kill, you should BE KILLED! (Killing purposely not accidentally)

>Why don't we just excuse the
>violation on the theory the
>act of rage, lashing out, was
>a momentary thing and we're so
>sorry we killed the person and
>we'll try not to do it again?

****Because there has to be some sort of short circuit in your brain if you kill someone. Beat them, put them in the hospital, whatever, but to take that final step and end a life, there is something wrong.

>As someone wrote, the law exists to
>bridle, or dampen, men's passions, not
>to encourage them.

****And what do you do when there is no longer any respect for the law?

>George makes the point that change is
>slow, that it takes a lot of time for
>people to become more civilized, in
>other words don't expect miracles around
>here wid' da StatNislanders, comin' from
>StatNisland, 'n' all, I guess.

****Since Staten Islander's don't make the laws of this Country, and since George has said that he believes in the DP, and he is a S.I.er, I don't think that was what he meant.

>But it's only by THINKING about this
>that we have a chance of making that
>progress. NOT thinking about it insures
>that we don't.

****I THINK about the DP all the time. I'm usually annoyed that someone that should be executed isn't.

>The question is whether it's a good idea
>for us to sink to barbaric levels to
>deal with the barbarians. When we do
>that we lose something in the process,
>and we gain something. We lose a degree
>of civilization and we gain a degree of
>barbarity.

****Barbarians understand ONE thing - FORCE. This is something I happen to have a lifetime's experience with. A violent person will ALWAYS be violent, and the ONLY thing they respect is someone more violent then they are.
Most violent criminals (in my experience), happen to think that everyday 9 to 5 working stiffs are nothing but things to abuse, and suckers that don't have the "b---s" to be like them.

>We took civilized young American boys
>and threw them into a war we didn't
>need, expecting them to kill people they
>didn't know. The young American boys
>did what we asked them to do. A lot of
>them came back the worse for the
>experience. Killing people you didn't
>know turned out to go against the grain
>of the way they'd been raised. One of
>the recent examples we spoke of here was
>ex-Sen. Bob Kerrey who has feelings of
>guilt and regret. He didn't want to be
>a barbarian.

****I'm not going to touch the war references, because I don't want to get angry, but Bob Kerrey only did what is considered politically correct nowadays.

>I don't want any part of being a
>barbarian if I can help it.

****Then stay out of it and let the big boys do it for you! =o)

>So far I haven't had to kill anybody,
>and I have no desire to start now.

****I sincerely hope you never have to. Because you would need a lifetime of therapy afterwards.

>If I could get people to stop killing in
>my name, like it's for my protection,
>yeah, right, I'd be just as happy.

****Yup, and you'd be the first crying out if a convicted murderer was released, and came and killed your wife and kids (God forbid).

>There's other ways to protect me without
>adding to the killing, thank you.

****I've been reading a lot of hot air, but I haven't seen you mention these "other ways".

>rs: That's the barbaric argument. It
>favors violence and bloodshed over all
>possible alternatives. It is
>incorrigible, meaning no amount of mere
>talk can make any possible difference.
>Attila the Hun wouldn't have had a
>problem with it at all, or maybe he
>would. Yeah, I think he might've.

****So again I am a barbarian? Or am I just using their arguments? Obviously, if I thought that there was no point to talking about it, I would just let you consider spewing what you think is right without trying to show the other side, or what I and many others think is right.
Jeez, I was a barbarian, a nazi, and now Attila the Hun, what's next tyrannasaurs rex?

>rs: see above, where the act of killing
>is its own reward, you gain something
>but you lose more than you gain. You
>teach that it's okay to kill when in
>fact it goes against one of our deepest
>core values, unless I've got that all
>wrong.

****Once again, I gain nothing except the knowledge that there is one less animal that could hurt my family on the face of this earth, and I LOSE nothing. We are NOT teaching that it is okay to kill, we are teaching that if you are a violent criminal, and are caught, you MAY lose YOUR life for YOUR crimes.

>California keeps building prisons to
>house all the lawbreakers who deserve to
>be kept off the streets. Most of the
>prisoners are drug dealers and users. I
>think we have 2 million people in prison
>in this country, more than we've ever
>had before and a larger percentage than
>any other country in the world. Only
>4,000 of these prisoners are on death
>row. Many thousands more are in prison
>for killing people, where the DP was not
>imposed. So Tom's BILLIONS and
>TRILLIONS doesn't hold water in support
>of his argument that it's too expensive
>to spare the lives of the DP candidates.
>According to my handheld calculator,
>that's a percentage of 0.002 death row
>prisoners to the rest of the prisoners.
>Infinitesimal. We kill them not to save
>money.

****You better check your calculator. It costs about $38,000 a year (there's LOTS of people with honest jobs that don't make that much) to support an inmate (some states it costs more others less) multiply that times ONLY the 4,000 people on death row NOW, and it comes out to $152MILLION dollars a year which in 20 years (some would live longer, and some less)it comes out to over $30BILLION dollars. Now considering how many people have already received the DP, add them to those figures along with the ones that are yet to be convicted, and tell me again how I'm wrong. If we didn't kill them we would have to build more prisons (at an average cost of $100 million) to have a place to keep them until they die. That means more guards salaries, administration costs, and other various costs.
I can count, can YOU?

>
>Nahh! We make distinctions.
>
>We force people in the military to work
>and don't call it slavery.

****The military is a volunteer outfit, slaves do NOT volunteer. Besides, you get an education, and the best medical care available.

>We force people in prison to agree to
>work for pennies and don't call it
>slavery.

****But it is nothing more than slavery.

>I wouldn't call it slavery to imprison
>someone we spared from execution whether
>we forced him to work or not.

****Ever hear the saying "Live free, or die"? By forcing someone to work without freedom, whether as a punishment or not, it IS slavery.
Or maybe you should tell all those angry black people that they weren't slaves, because we make distinctions.

>As far as I'm concerned, the reason
>we're sparing him is not because HE
>deserves it but because WE deserve it.

****I guess you don't believe in us deserving to be free from these animals either.
I just LOVE the fact that my tax money goes to support these animals, and that they get better medical care than most of the Country, thanks again to my tax dollars.

>Why let him force US down to HIS level?

****HE is NOT forcing US down to HIS level, WE are using one of the only practices HE understands. Violence begets violence, and all that.

>In other words, I prefer the choice
>that's less barbaric.

****What YOU consider to be less barbaric. Get that right please.

>Root out the barbaric elements, in other
>words.

****Which is exactly what killing them does. They are rooted out of society, aren't they?
Tom


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